Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

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GrandpaDuck
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by GrandpaDuck »

Duckenstein wrote:Maybe so, but elite OCs don't grow on trees

I'd love to see an upgrade there, but it's not a guarantee if we ditch Arroyo
Merganzer wrote:
Duckenstein wrote:I'm not sold on arroyo, and he's not an elite OC

But the issues aren't really with playcalling imo, they're with personnel
This seems to be the crux of the problem; wrong play calling for the players on the team.
The only thing elite about Arroyo was the number of emojis he puts in his tweets. Willie hired him as a recruiter and QB coach. He has zero good seasons as a play calling OC in his resume. That said, the problem is more playbook and offensive philosophy than play calling. This isn't Arroyo's offense they are running, it's Cristobol's. Same philosophy and look as his FIU teams. Arroyo can't call what isn't in the playbook. What's worse MC is a true believer in a system that has achieved mediocre results at its best.

If you hire a new OC and handcuff him with a frequently disproved offensive theory, what would be the point. Might as well keep the guy who can put 15 emojis in a tweet about going to the can.
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Duckenstein
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by Duckenstein »

That might be partly true, but not 100%

They are working from the Pistol, which is Mastro

So there is definitely input coming from outside
GrandpaDuck wrote:
Duckenstein wrote:Maybe so, but elite OCs don't grow on trees

I'd love to see an upgrade there, but it's not a guarantee if we ditch Arroyo
Merganzer wrote:
Duckenstein wrote:I'm not sold on arroyo, and he's not an elite OC

But the issues aren't really with playcalling imo, they're with personnel
This seems to be the crux of the problem; wrong play calling for the players on the team.
The only thing elite about Arroyo was the number of emojis he puts in his tweets. Willie hired him as a recruiter and QB coach. He has zero good seasons as a play calling OC in his resume. That said, the problem is more playbook and offensive philosophy than play calling. This isn't Arroyo's offense they are running, it's Cristobol's. Same philosophy and look as his FIU teams. Arroyo can't call what isn't in the playbook. What's worse MC is a true believer in a system that has achieved mediocre results at its best.

If you hire a new OC and handcuff him with a frequently disproved offensive theory, what would be the point. Might as well keep the guy who can put 15 emojis in a tweet about going to the can.
GrandpaDuck
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by GrandpaDuck »

Duckenstein wrote:That might be partly true, but not 100%

They are working from the Pistol, which is Mastro

So there is definitely input coming from outside


This proves my point about handcuffing a Coach. They are lined up in a Pistol on many occasions, but the playbook has been stripped of the the plays that made it fly at Nevada. You can watch games of the Kap era on Youtube. UO may look like the Nevada Pistol pre-snap but that offense challenged the edges, and had bend and bounce in it. This running offense is blast blast blast. The Pistol has pros and cons, and the Pros aren't being used at all. That's MC not Mastrol.
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FlDuckFan
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by FlDuckFan »

This is the first season for the staff under MC. There is going to be A LOT of learning curves and lessons learned the hard way for both the players and the staff. Experience is a great teacher , this staff has already shown that they can and do make adjustments when needed on the field. After this year they will have a better understanding of how to implement Cristobal's vision of what he wants his team to look and play like. While I've made it clear I'm not a big fan of the play calling I haven't lost any confidence in the coaching staff. A lot of the players are not tailored to the style of play Oregon is transitioning into and so there will be lot's of hiccups and inability to consistently perform their assigned task. This isn't the only reason for the issues the team is experiencing but it is a large one.
duck58
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by duck58 »

pezsez1 wrote:Chip Kelly with Justin Herbert? Dear lord, that would be amazing!

Ain't happening, though. And that's not a bad thing... Cristoball is trying to play a different brand of football with leftovers from Helfrich's final classes. The near miss against Stanford and the win over Washington gave lots of reason for optimism, but what we're seeing now is pretty much what all the experts expected.

Give Cristoball a couple years to get his players.

All that said... I'm definitely not sold on Arroyo. In college football, choosing to ignore creativity and misdirection is basically choosing to leave money on the table. We can still be physical while also keeping opponents guessing.
While I agree giving Cristoball more time, I don't don't get a feeling of optimism from the Stanford and Washington games. The PAC-12 is terrible this year. Does any PAC-12 team even have a so-called quality win? WSU is 9-1. I can't see a quality win. UW lost to Auburn, UO, and Cal. Last I saw, The only one ranked was Auburn at 24. Stanford no better. Can you imagine any PAC-12 team playing Michigan or tOSU?
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pezsez1
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by pezsez1 »

While I agree giving Cristoball more time, I don't don't get a feeling of optimism from the Stanford and Washington games. The PAC-12 is terrible this year. Does any PAC-12 team even have a so-called quality win? WSU is 9-1. I can't see a quality win. UW lost to Auburn, UO, and Cal. Last I saw, The only one ranked was Auburn at 24. Stanford no better. Can you imagine any PAC-12 team playing Michigan or tOSU?
You're harshing what little buzz I have left. :(
Willie Taggart is a dick.
duck58
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by duck58 »

pezsez1 wrote:
While I agree giving Cristoball more time, I don't don't get a feeling of optimism from the Stanford and Washington games. The PAC-12 is terrible this year. Does any PAC-12 team even have a so-called quality win? WSU is 9-1. I can't see a quality win. UW lost to Auburn, UO, and Cal. Last I saw, The only one ranked was Auburn at 24. Stanford no better. Can you imagine any PAC-12 team playing Michigan or tOSU?
You're harshing what little buzz I have left. :(
Nah! I'm just totally disappointed in the PAC-12 this year At this point, I am hoping for WSU to win it, not UW.
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nogerO
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by nogerO »

Hate to disagree, but it is the problem. That and stubbornness to run the ball period! Everybody knows what's coming, how about some short passes or screen plays or fly sweeps or counter action on first down to set up the run. Running up the gut to set up the pass is not working especially if we have to throw on third down and it's third and 7-12 yards to go because we got stuffed on first and second down because even 6 year olds know it's coming. NOT impressed by Arroyo and trying real hard to find something about the head coach to be excited about. I will withhold calling for canning the entire staff until about another year and a half after this recruiting class shows up and we have some talent to work with. Anything less than improvement the next two years would be a good case to start over, again. Anybody else excited to play in the Poulan Weed Eater Bowl somewhere in Louisiana? Yeah I know about Musgrave and how excited we were back in the day...
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine
rockthief
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Re: Offensive Playcalling is NOT the problem

Post by rockthief »

How about calling plays that match the skill set of the players?
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