dd10snoop28 wrote:Wait, so you are making an assertion about the "vast majority" being unvaccinated based off of what? The article you provided doesn't mention it. I'll follow the data wherever it leads but you made a blank assertion with a link that didn't address your assertion in the least. I'll disregard the name-calling.pezsez1 wrote:Yes, and the vast majority are unvaccinated."JUST IN: More Americans have died from COVID-19 this year than from the virus in all of 2020, according to newly updated data from Johns Hopkins University."
I'm not even posting a link. If you'd stop acting like a schmuck you could figure this out for yourself in like 2 minutes.
Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
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- dd10snoop28
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
pezsez1 wrote:(even 20 percent after five months is better than zero)
Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
It is, though... and still 96% effective in reducing severe illness and death, which is why the vast majority of people filling the hospitals now are unvaccinated even as efficacy wanes among the vaccinated.(even 20 percent after five months is better than zero)
Remember... eventually, we'll get to a place where COVID spreads pretty freely (like the cold) but nobody really gets sick and dies from it. That's the endgame... and vaccines appear to do that while also curbing spread.
I honestly don't get the anger/disbelief over this. The vaccines are working, and the Delta surge is also subsiding. The worst of the pandemic is probably over with, and boosters will likely be the nail in the coffin. You all should be happy and not so defensive about how vaccines are helping. It's much faster for people to get vaccinated than wait to get infected and hopefully recover... and, in the meantime, those who can't yet be vaccinated are better protected. These are GOOD things that you're allowed to SMILE about.
Last edited by pezsez1 on Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- dd10snoop28
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
I mean, you are essentially just repeating the main narrative of people who have zero interest in your well-being.pezsez1 wrote:Wasn't planning on coming back to this dumpster fire of a thread today, but just read this article and it's totally relevant here.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medica ... d=msedgntp
It details a new study released today and two others released in Israel... shows that efficacy of the Pfizer vaccine (both doses) against Delta fell from 77 percent in the first month to roughly 20 percent in months 5-7... but, throughout that time, the vaccine remained 96 percent effective in preventing severe/fatal infections.
This shows, again, that yes, vaccines do offer protection (even 20 percent after five months is better than zero) and also explains why case rates are rising in highly vaccinated areas -- because of waning efficacy.
It also shows why, despite those rises, it's mostly unvaccinated who are getting severely ill and dying.
Also shows why Israel is offering boosters to everyone and why we'll probably be doing the same.
It really doesn't get any plainer than this.
It goes like this:
1) Promise of vaccine to return to: (1) normal society (2) substantially reduce spread (transmission/inception), and (3) only need one shot... i.e. zero discourse about the need for subsequent shots.
2) Cases begin to spike as vaccines wane, in direct contradiction to promises of major stakeholders (who have significant motivation to withhold the truth - the motivation being power and profit).
3) Major stakeholders move goalposts to focus less on the data of "cases" because that would show that they knowingly withheld information, and that the narrative of "unvaccinated" being the sole cause of the surge would be proven false.
4) Major stakeholders shift strategy to emphasize the need for "boosters", knowing from the beginning that multiple boosters over multiple years would be the end goal.
5) Common people believe the narrative fed to them by money-motivated and power-hungry stakeholders.
Last edited by dd10snoop28 on Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
Nope, not repeating that narrative, in fact in my next post I make it clear (yet again) that my beliefs in no way, shape or form line up with your little narrative.I mean, you are essentially just repeating the main narrative.
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- dd10snoop28
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
Well, I think a good litmus test of not following the narrative is a very specific one.pezsez1 wrote:Nope, not repeating that narrative, in fact in my next post I make it clear (yet again) that my beliefs in no way, shape or form line up with your little narrative.I mean, you are essentially just repeating the main narrative.
All of historical science has shown that previous infection of a specific virus is the best inhibitor against subsequent infection of the same virus.
So while all of the world was locking down and granting certain freedoms to the "vaccinated" and excluding the "unvaccinated", did you ever at any point think to challenge the mainstream narrative that the previously infected should be excluded alongside the unvaccinated?
You never wondered: "hmmm, why are the vaccinated being treated better than those who previously got the virus? Doesn't that go against all long-standing understanding of basic virology?"
Last edited by dd10snoop28 on Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
It goes like this:
In other words, not only did I fail to see this shift in narrative you've described, but awareness of cases remained strong and it was pretty damning toward the decision to remain unvaccinated.
And yes, medical experts have been brutally honest from the start that we likely could always have COVID vaccine boosters. If this is a secret conspiracy, then it's the worst secret conspiracy ever because it's been all over the news for a year. Where have you been????
Also, just because we'll have boosters doesn't mean you'll be required to take them. I'll make you a gentleman's bet right here, right now. If COVID vaccines of any kind are still required to get into Autzen by the start of the 2023 football season, I'll drive to wherever you live (provided you're still in Oregon), meet you at a bar and buy your drinks while you celebrate how wrong I was. You'd owe me the same pleasure, of course, if you're on the wrong side of this.
This is just laughable. We've been talking about how we'll probably need boosters (like with the flu vaccine) since 2020.1) Promise of vaccine to return to: (1) normal society (2) substantially reduce spread (transmission/inception), and (3) only need one shot... i.e. zero discourse about the need for subsequent shots.
What promises? I've never seen this except from the mouths of some politicians. Meanwhile, I've watched health experts repeatedly warn us that this isn't over, that our vaccination rates aren't nearly high enough, that we needed to be mindful of mutations, and that even "normal" now shouldn't yet look like "normal" in 2019.2) Cases begin to spike as vaccines wane, in direct contradiction to promises of major stakeholders (who have significant motivation to withhold the truth - the motivation being power and profit).
You're starting to lose me here because I don't know who your "major stakeholders" are who are "moving goalposts." But there has been nothing in either the news coverage or actual peer-reviewed studies that have disputed the fact that the virus has spread more rapidly (and with more deaths) in regions with lower vaccination rates.3) Major stakeholders move goalposts to focus less on the data of "cases" because that would show that they knowingly withheld information, and that the narrative of "unvaccinated" being the sole cause of the surge would be proven false.
In other words, not only did I fail to see this shift in narrative you've described, but awareness of cases remained strong and it was pretty damning toward the decision to remain unvaccinated.
Who shifted strategy? Who do you think is in charge of this stakeholder cabal?4) Major stakeholders shift strategy to emphasize the need for "boosters", knowing from the beginning that multiple boosters over multiple years would be the end goal.
And yes, medical experts have been brutally honest from the start that we likely could always have COVID vaccine boosters. If this is a secret conspiracy, then it's the worst secret conspiracy ever because it's been all over the news for a year. Where have you been????
Also, just because we'll have boosters doesn't mean you'll be required to take them. I'll make you a gentleman's bet right here, right now. If COVID vaccines of any kind are still required to get into Autzen by the start of the 2023 football season, I'll drive to wherever you live (provided you're still in Oregon), meet you at a bar and buy your drinks while you celebrate how wrong I was. You'd owe me the same pleasure, of course, if you're on the wrong side of this.
Good thing I'm not a common person.5) Common people believe the narrative fed by them who care little for their concerns and a lot about their own power and $$.
Willie Taggart is a dick.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
Two part answer... for right now and for later.So while all of the world was locking down and granting certain freedoms to the "vaccinated" and excluding the "unvaccinated", did you ever at any point think to challenge the mainstream narrative that the previously infected should be excluded alongside the unvaccinated?
The problem with this line of thinking RIGHT NOW is that COVID is significantly dangerous even if it isn't significantly deadly. Also, it's wildly contagious, and each variant seems to spread more efficiently. And we still have a pretty large "fresh meat" population that is ripe to be hospitalized.
We can afford that line of thinking with the flu. We have vaccines, and not everyone gets them, and sometimes they're not as effective, but it generally doesn't matter because the flu doesn't spread as rapidly, it's not too deadly (only like 40k deaths/year) and it isn't associated with any real complications.
COVID, on the other hand... spreads like wildfire, kills a ton of old/sick people, and causes all kinds of fun stuff like Long COVID, blood clots, lung damage, etc. in everyone else.
Combine that with the fact that we've spent much of the past year simply trying to learn what we were dealing with because COVID was a completely new virus.
For later, though...
Yes, I definitely believe we will have vaccinated people and unvaccinated people mingling freely just as we do with the cold or flu. People who've never been exposed to the virus can choose to get vaccinated to protect themselves from severe illness, and over time everyone will be infected (even vaccinated people) and gain the protection of natural antibodies but with far fewer deaths along the way. We won't need to worry about breaking our healthcare system or running out of hospital beds because people sick with COVID will rarely go to the hospital.
Someday, getting a COVID vaccine will be just like getting a flu vaccine... we'll get them not because there's a pandemic, but because we'd rather not get sick and miss a few days of work, and if you skip it (or get lazy) then it won't be a big deal.
Last edited by pezsez1 on Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- dd10snoop28
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
Your 6 paragraph response did not come anywhere near to answering the question. Maybe you misread it.pezsez1 wrote:The problem with this line of thinking is that COVID is significantly dangerous even if it isn't significantly deadly. Also, it's wildly contagious, and each variant seems to spread more efficiently. And we still have a pretty large "fresh meat" population that is ripe to be hospitalized.So while all of the world was locking down and granting certain freedoms to the "vaccinated" and excluding the "unvaccinated", did you ever at any point think to challenge the mainstream narrative that the previously infected should be excluded alongside the unvaccinated?
We can afford that line of thinking with the flu. We have vaccines, and not everyone gets them, and sometimes they're not as effective, but it generally doesn't matter because the flu doesn't spread as rapidly, it's not too deadly (only like 40k deaths/year) and it isn't associated with any real complications.
COVID, on the other hand... spreads like wildfire, kills a ton of old/sick people, and causes all kinds of fun stuff like Long COVID, blood clots, lung damage, etc. in everyone else.
Combine that with the fact that we've spent much of the past year simply trying to learn what we were dealing with because COVID was a completely new virus.
Going forward, though, yeah... I definitely believe we will have vaccinated people and unvaccinated people mingling freely just as we do with the cold or flu. People who've never been exposed to the virus can choose to get vaccinated to protect themselves from severe illness, and over time everyone will be infected (even vaccinated people) and gain the protection of natural antibodies but with far fewer deaths along the way.
Someday, getting a COVID vaccine will be just like getting a flu vaccine... we'll get them not because there's a pandemic, but because we'd rather not get sick and miss a few days of work.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
I answered it pretty clearly. Try reading it again.Your 6 paragraph response did not come anywhere near to answering the question. Maybe you misread it.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
It's funny because you and I actually agree that unvaccinated people and vaccinated people eventually need to go back into the world in shared space.
We only disagree on the timing.
We only disagree on the timing.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
My point is not about the vaccinated/unvaccinated mingling or not if you are reading in the context of the prior sentence. That's what your post seems to be addressing but that's not what I was talking about.pezsez1 wrote:I answered it pretty clearly. Try reading it again.Your 6 paragraph response did not come anywhere near to answering the question. Maybe you misread it.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
How about this:My point is not about the vaccinated/unvaccinated mingling or not if you are reading in the context of the prior sentence. That's what your post seems to be addressing but that's not what I was talking about.
Yes, I definitely stopped to ask myself that question. I'm an extremely critical person. Especially with a baby coming, I spent lots of time thinking about the condition of our country and what might put us on a better path.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
And did your opinion deviate from the mainstream narrative?pezsez1 wrote:How about this:My point is not about the vaccinated/unvaccinated mingling or not if you are reading in the context of the prior sentence. That's what your post seems to be addressing but that's not what I was talking about.
Yes, I definitely stopped to ask myself that question. I'm an extremely critical person. Especially with a baby coming, I spent lots of time thinking about the condition of our country and what might put us on a better path.
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Re: Team/League COVID Safety Protocols For 2021
I honestly don't know what you mean by "mainstream narrative." I get the feeling a narrative was portrayed to you that wouldn't match up with the reality I was living. Frankly, I don't really care, but you're basically asking me if I agree with clouds in the sky.
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