OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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UofDuck
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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StevensTechU wrote:I think our QB recruiting is actually flawed. Aside from Thompson, they recruited Butterfield (can't run), Ashford (couldn't pass in high school; major project), and Tanner Bailey might have the lowest ceiling of any QB recruit we've signed in recent memory. Thompson has a chance to be good, but theyre resting a lot on his shoulders.
Why do you insist that Butters can’t run? He’s no Lamar Jackson, but he can move a little. Clearly he is drop back passer, but it looked to me he has some running abilities.


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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... n-comeback

Wonder why other teams don't have such an aversion to playing a freshman at qb? Anyone remember a kid named Herbert who got thrown into the fire. I think he turned out ok. I would hope TT has been getting at least half the reps with the 1's for this bye weeks practices.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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nogerO wrote:https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... n-comeback

Wonder why other teams don't have such an aversion to playing a freshman at qb? Anyone remember a kid named Herbert who got thrown into the fire. I think he turned out ok. I would hope TT has been getting at least half the reps with the 1's for this bye weeks practices.
For starters, comparing the Oklahoma QB room with Lincoln Riley, coach of 2 Heisman QBs to the Oregon QB room with Joe Moorhead is not the same in any way.

The 2nd is that it's already been pointed out that Herbert as a HS SR had far and away the more impressive tape than Thompson. Not even close when you watch the sheer arm talent, which is also what stood out from his first series throwing the football. To compare the arms of Herbert and Thompson at this respective stage ignores their respective skill to this point. Here is his first start against the Poodles, who had one of the better Pac 12 defenses in the last decade that year and would lose 24-7 to Bama in the CFP.

Ty Thompson (or Butterfield) will hopefully lead Oregon to more wins on a bigger stage than Justin Herbert was able to, but to suggest that these 2 QBs in their respective systems/coaches are comparable right now ignores the film. We don't have a QB on this roster right now capable of making some of the throws that Justin did in that clip.

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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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Mostly just want to say "x2" to what Duck07 said, but also to respond to the Butterfield comment.

Moorhead runs his QBs about 10x per game. Admittedly, the number of times I've seen Butterfield run is really small, so I'm basing my comments on a small sample plus probably poor recall, but my memory seems to think that he isn't legitimate enough of a running threat for the defense to take him seriously. If defenses load up against the running back, that kills the offense, obviously.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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I’m not sure Butterfield’s arm isn’t close to what Justin’s was when he was a Freshman. It’s hard to compare, but we’ve heard from folks on the inside that he has a very strong arm. Showing game tape on Justin and not on Butterfield doesn’t indicate much between the two. I also think Butterfield has serviceable legs. Is he the future? I have no idea, but I’d like to push him out their to find out. Not just to handoff the ball, but meaningful snaps.

Watching TT left me with the impression his arm is decent too, though maybe not amazing. I’d like to see him get some game reps too

Boiling it down, and I hate putting this out there at this point, but I’d say Butterfield is closer to Herbert and Ty is closer to Mariotta, while AB is a bit like DT in skill sets. I realize it’s impossible to compare them to Oregon gods - and TT’s doesn’t have Marcus’ wheels etc, and before people’s head’s explode over these comparisons, TT and Butterfield were both significantly higher rated than Marcus or Herbert coming out of HS, so it’s not blasphemy to compare them all as Freshmen.

Here’s my take, push one of them out there as soon as it makes sense and while the game is still somewhat is question and see how it goes. We need to start developing one/both of them. I’m convinced both have a ton of potential. Let’s see how they do when the lights are bright. We need to build for the future. Our rushing attack is not significant enough to survive with just a game manager ala Oregon 10 years ago with DT/LaMichael, or Alabama 5 years ago. times have changed and QBs have to learn to be dynamic.


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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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Mariota and Herbert being lowly rated isn't an indication of their skill level in high school, it's an indictment of how crappy the rating system can be. Herbert and Mariota both garnered rave reviews about what they were doing in practice, and we haven't heard those things about any of the current freshmen beyond 'they're working hard and getting better.'
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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StevensTechU wrote:Mariota and Herbert being lowly rated isn't an indication of their skill level in high school, it's an indictment of how crappy the rating system can be. Herbert and Mariota both garnered rave reviews about what they were doing in practice, and we haven't heard those things about any of the current freshmen beyond 'they're working hard and getting better.'
They also didn't go to many camps and played very little in their JR years, which is when a lot of players start standing out to college coaches.
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OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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greenyellow wrote:
StevensTechU wrote:Mariota and Herbert being lowly rated isn't an indication of their skill level in high school, it's an indictment of how crappy the rating system can be. Herbert and Mariota both garnered rave reviews about what they were doing in practice, and we haven't heard those things about any of the current freshmen beyond 'they're working hard and getting better.'
They also didn't go to many camps and played very little in their JR years, which is when a lot of players start standing out to college coaches.
Clearly Mariota and Herbert were underrated, but why do you assume Ty and Butters are overrated? Because there hasn’t been rumors leaking out about their awesomeness? My point is, and will remain that they should get some run during the next few games. I don’t buy that both don’t have higher than average ceilings. Let’s find out sooner than later. The only other option is sticking with a ho-hum game manager until handoff time. Lincoln took a chance on a Freshman QB and it paid dividends. Would it with ours? Who knows, but why not try? I love Mario, but I wish I’d see him take a timely gamble sometimes.


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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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UofDuck wrote:]Clearly Mariota and Herbert were underrated, but why do you assume Ty and Butters are overrated? Because there hasn’t been rumors leaking out about their awesomeness? My point is, and will remain that they should get some run during the next few games. I don’t buy that both don’t have higher than average ceilings. Let’s find out sooner than later. The only other option is sticking with a ho-hum game manager until handoff time. Lincoln took a chance on a Freshman QB and it paid dividends. Would it with ours? Who knows, but why not try? I love Mario, but I wish I’d see him take a timely gamble sometimes.
This isn't what any of us are saying though. We have seen Ty Thompson in a game and his throws so far don't scream "play me" because so far he has looked like a true freshman. Nor are we arguing that neither of them should get any run but Mario also has to balance this with winning as many games as possible and so far to date they believe that Brown does that.

I'm still of the mindset that it is best for us to try to win out and lacking any insight into practices, it still seems that Brown and a healthy Moorhead give us the best chance of doing that with healthy players coming back on defense soon but as I've stated, if there was a 2-week period to make any changes at QB, this is that period and we will find out come kickoff. If Brown starts then lets all hope he does well enough that we do get to see the backups play. If not, then I'm not going to post-facto argue that this was a Prukop/Herbert situation where the backup should have started Game 1 because we won in Ohio State and that still matters this season and going forward.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

Post by northbeachsf »

ncduck wrote:
OregonFan4Life wrote:And they came back and won too. It worked for them! It does make me wonder why Thomson and Butterfield aren’t ready to start, what are the coaches not doing to prepare them?
May also be about the players’ ability to pick up enough of the playbook or show they can implement it or read a defense.
How difficult could the playbook be?

Hand ball to running back
repeat
Throw 5 yard out
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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northbeachsf wrote: How difficult could the playbook be? :lol:
Defense has changed a lot Post-Chip so much that most HS Defenses are teaching Scrapes and its one reason why I don't like the way the QB runs in most schemes because the D has adjusted and now your QB is really a glorified RB on that play. In the case of Thompson it's been noted on film that he didn't have to go through read progressions often or at all in HS. Conversely, Sam Vidlak out of Hidden Vally at Oregon State can cycle through the offense but he's a skinny 19 year old who isn't meant to run the RPO.

Every week you ask the QB to absorb a new Defensive scheme and how you align your offense to attack it. You have specific responsibilities to call out and for a Freshman, now that the first 3 games are up, you have to take classes and show up to study hall at the Jacqua in your free time rather.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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buckmarkduck wrote: JT Daniels wanted to transfer to UO, and we told him no thanks. We also told Jayden Daniels we were full at QB when he wanted to come to UO. Our QB room would be much different if they had made better decisions on QB evaluation and who to take.
If this is true, then this is really troubling. Along with the fact that we were 1 of 4 FBS teams not to take a non-graduate transfer from the transfer portal last year. Mario even made the comment when asked about transfers saying something along the lines of the available transfers didn't fit what Oregon was trying to do.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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Mario loading up on high schoolers instead of leaving room for transfers is a strategic decision. I don't necessarily agree with it, but it's definitely the path he's chosen.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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Thought it was interesting that in today's "Quack Minute," Moseley said Butterfield and Thompson are rotating with the 2s, which suggests Thompson hasn't elevated his play to separate from Butterfield yet.

I hope we see a blowout against Cal so we can see these guys in action.
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Re: OU’s Rattler on ice for Freshman QB

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StevensTechU wrote:Thought it was interesting that in today's "Quack Minute," Moseley said Butterfield and Thompson are rotating with the 2s, which suggests Thompson hasn't elevated his play to separate from Butterfield yet.

I hope we see a blowout against Cal so we can see these guys in action.
Or it could be Butterfield has elevated his game to that of TT...Hopefully...

Agree, some real game action with the both of them would be great and shine some light on the QB2 situation.
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