Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post Completed Trades Here

Moderators: UOducksTK1, Zyme, lukeyrid13, Oregon Ownage

User avatar
dd10snoop28
Senior
Posts: 4815
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:06 am
GM: New Jersey Nets GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by dd10snoop28 »

Oregon Ownage wrote:
Foxyg1396 wrote:
Oregon Ownage wrote:
Foxyg1396 wrote:
Craig wrote:Thats awfully generous
I mean yes, but then I essentially get a first and some rookies for free
Its not really free as you are giving away cap space to help a conference foe get under the cap. You are hurting your team by accepting that deal and giving away the leverage
And if they don’t get under hardcap, I get those pieces for free instead of giving up Armstrong. How is that hurting my team?
You are trading cap space hence its not free. Free would be dealing away a scrub signed to a one year deal to match salaries. Plus you are taking up roster spots on players who project as best backups? Its not like they are good young players who can develop into something

Now for this comment
Foxyg1396 wrote:Everyone always complains about Grizz getting deals and players but nobody wants to trade anymore. If everyone wasn’t so stingy then maybe there would be a wider spread of talent across the league.

Very few teams try to correct their deficiencies, and then get mad when teams like clippers, and grizzlies correct theirs
I love trading and have been working the phones but when GMs reach out to me, I am very clear in what I value players for and wont accept anything less than what I think they are worth. Do I lose deals b/c of this? Absolutely I do, but more often than not GMs will reach back out again with an improved offer.

Also, if teams are not trading its b/c they do not want to engage with a bad deal and accepting less than ideal offers for players or overpaying for average players. That IMO is healthy for the league. Dealing players for less than their value which you did with Armstrong is not good for the league and only condenses the talent to select teams. I said this previously, why would a GM come to you with an acceptable offer when you have shown in the past to accept less than fair value for your players? You have no leverage in trades and are only doing favors for other teams while not evaluating your team properly and as a result hampering further moves.

In this trade, you dealt the best player and got back a late 1st, backup big (Miller) and wasted cap space for future seasons. How does that help your team moving forward?

It was better to hold onto Armstrong into the off-season for a better offer or continue to construct your roster with Armstrong but instead dealt one of your better assets
He is trading "cap space" but I would argue it's not cap space that holds much value. Unless they were able to deal Walt Williams for expirings, they wouldn't have any cap space to work with this offseason and would be limited to MLE/LLE, so the lost cap space is not that big of a deal.

Armstrong is really good, and probably could be considered a top 7 PG, but:

1- offense isn't consistent
2- he is still 31 yrs old on 3yr max contract

The 2nd part is the biggest deal. Many of the competing teams don't have any cap space and so trading for a 31yr old on a max contract just wouldn't work. I mean, that's the whole reason that the Grizz structured the deal so that they could get Armstrong.

Agree with the rest of your post.
Image
User avatar
Craig
Senior
Posts: 2418
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2017 3:16 pm
GM: Phoenix Suns GM

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by Craig »

I dont think the value for Armstrong is terrible...just have never seen anyone willing to hold cap like that lol. Maybe its just abnormally pragmatic and foxy is ahead of the curve...
SUNS GM
User avatar
jibbajabba614
Senior
Posts: 2410
Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 6:32 pm
GM: Milwaukee Bucks GM

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by jibbajabba614 »

As far as value, DArm is clearly worth more. I can see the upset for a 1 year rental for a ring and having a plan to get under the hard cap in 1 deal.

But sometimes you just gotta rebuild and get as many assets for that rebuild.

For me, Peja was more or less my DArm, but I wasn’t letting him go without at least 3 1st’s. I had a great offer for a 01 and 02 1st but sometimes you gotta hold your ground especially if you feel you got a special player. DArm’s window is closing so I’m sure he’s hoping to get him in the off season back and ship him for another first
User avatar
lukeyrid13
All-American
Posts: 10484
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:58 am
GM: Portland TrailBlazers

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by lukeyrid13 »

Value isn’t terrible. Cap space option definitely changes things
User avatar
jibbajabba614
Senior
Posts: 2410
Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 6:32 pm
GM: Milwaukee Bucks GM

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by jibbajabba614 »

lukeyrid13 wrote:Value isn’t terrible. Cap space option definitely changes things
The stipulation is crazy cause Nuggets won’t have cap space but Grizz will definitely be over hard cap. So how does Nuggets save the day? That’s the biggest question
User avatar
dd10snoop28
Senior
Posts: 4815
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:06 am
GM: New Jersey Nets GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by dd10snoop28 »

jibbajabba614 wrote:
lukeyrid13 wrote:Value isn’t terrible. Cap space option definitely changes things
The stipulation is crazy cause Nuggets won’t have cap space but Grizz will definitely be over hard cap. So how does Nuggets save the day? That’s the biggest question
This would be a legal nightmare in real life. A key provision not detailed in writing that may have serious consequences for a team being over hard cap....

nefariousness all around
Image
User avatar
dd10snoop28
Senior
Posts: 4815
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:06 am
GM: New Jersey Nets GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by dd10snoop28 »

also, why is it always grizz/nuggs in the controversial deals???

I bet they are the same person with 2 accounts.
Image
User avatar
jibbajabba614
Senior
Posts: 2410
Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 6:32 pm
GM: Milwaukee Bucks GM

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by jibbajabba614 »

dd10snoop28 wrote:also, why is it always grizz/nuggs in the controversial deals???

I bet they are the same person with 2 accounts.
Tracing IP addresses is a start…

I don’t think we’ve had this happen yet so I would definitely hope someone is supervising this.

Personally, I think Grizz was trying to get ring and Nuggets frustrated over other offers

Even if he keeps Stoudy he can still pickup another pick
User avatar
jibbajabba614
Senior
Posts: 2410
Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 6:32 pm
GM: Milwaukee Bucks GM

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by jibbajabba614 »

I just remember I had an employee join league cause he was a gamer but didn’t know what sim leagues were.

Sometimes we would have same IP address. And TK brought it up to me.

I think he was a spurs GM in 1.0. Roach.
User avatar
offtheheezy
Senior
Posts: 2151
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:09 pm
GM: Vancouver Grizzlies

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by offtheheezy »

:lol:
User avatar
offtheheezy
Senior
Posts: 2151
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:09 pm
GM: Vancouver Grizzlies

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by offtheheezy »

Nuggets don't got cap space this is literally so I have some sort of even ground leverage when making other deals where I'm not told "lose a ton of value bc you're over hard cap and I'm trying to take advantage of you. Gimme 2 picks + Armstrong for cap space"

Worst case I can just make a deal with the Nuggets and shed the ~2M cap using salary matching or tradebacks

I don't want to be using the stipulation
User avatar
offtheheezy
Senior
Posts: 2151
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:09 pm
GM: Vancouver Grizzlies

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by offtheheezy »

dd10snoop28 wrote:also, why is it always grizz/nuggs in the controversial deals???

I bet they are the same person with 2 accounts.
Oh no you caught us!
User avatar
pistolpetejr
Senior
Posts: 2963
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:48 pm
GM: Los Angeles Clippers

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by pistolpetejr »

What a time to be in sim leagues lol.
---
Image

PistolPeteJR
User avatar
Cellar-door
Senior
Posts: 2244
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:06 pm
GM: Charlotte Hornets

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by Cellar-door »

Armstrong is pretty good, but he's 31, and this year's scoring jump was accompanied by a decrease in efficiency. There are a lot of PGs out there, I mean, he's not significantly different than say Gary Payton, who is good, but not top 5. PG is a good 10+ deep with Armstrong level or better players and given that basically every team looking to compete already has one... not sure how much you could flip him for.

Seems like a reasonable deal all around to me.
Hornets GM
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37589
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Grizzlies / Nuggets

Post by UOducksTK1 »

This is stressful.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
Post Reply