NDSU/OREGON 2020

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ncduck
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by ncduck »

Lakesbison wrote:if NDSU was power 5 /FBS. theyd have 22 more full rides and easily increase their recruiting from predominantly 2 and 1 star kids to 2/3 star & Occasional 4 star and absolutely would be a top G5 team
Not today, which is what everyone is talking about.

I have a feeling you wouldn't find it so easy to increasing recruiting. The competition for 3+ star athletes is really fierce. Moving up to G5 alone won't fix the campus being a long way from home for the best athletes. It was a huge problem for Oregon until UO proved it could win and seriously upgraded the facilities and brand image. Simply going G5 doesn't fix those problems.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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ncduck wrote:
Lakesbison wrote:if NDSU was power 5 /FBS. theyd have 22 more full rides and easily increase their recruiting from predominantly 2 and 1 star kids to 2/3 star & Occasional 4 star and absolutely would be a top G5 team
Not today, which is what everyone is talking about.

I have a feeling you wouldn't find it so easy to increasing recruiting. The competition for 3+ star athletes is really fierce. Moving up to G5 alone won't fix the campus being a long way from home for the best athletes. It was a huge problem for Oregon until UO proved it could win and seriously upgraded the facilities and brand image. Simply going G5 doesn't fix those problems.
Does NDSU have the cash to afford another 22 scholarship recruits on top of all the extra money it will take to recruit at a higher level? I'm not sure how much extra $ they'd get with a G5 conf tv deal but I can't imagine it would be that much.

Would making it to the Cheez-It bowl at the FBS level be better for the NDSU program than staying where they are? I tend to think they're better being a big fish in a small pond than trying to swim with the sharks in the ocean.
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NomadBison
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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No, as it currently stands we don’t have the money in any way to move up let alone for scholarships which currently are being paid for by private donations across all sports. Bowl games don’t do it for most Bison fans. For me personally it would have to be a NY6 bowl I guess or a bowl against a P5 school.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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Unless the MAC somehow takes NDSU as a football only member I don't think they'll be moving up to big boy football any time soon.

Their stadium seats 19,000 people. They are isolated, even for the MAC. The closest MAC team, NIU, is nearly 600 miles away.

The metro population of Fargo is under 250k. The entire population of North Dakota is 760k, while Oregon's is 4.2 mil.

I didn't realize just how WIDE the gap is between a top P-5 team like Oregon and NDSU.

Their football budget is just $4.8 million. We're paying our coaches alone $5.6 million next year, and with bonuses we paid out nearly $7 mil this year to coaches. Entz, their HC, makes less or comparable to our position coaches. Heyward and Big Joe earn close to double. Donte, Bobby Williams, Mastro, and Mirabal all have higher base salaries.

Oregon's football staff is 40-45 people, theirs is ~20. NDSU's highest AD revenue in the past few years is $25 million, Oregon's is $145 million. Their facilities are more cinder block and industrial carpet, while ours are glass and exotic hardwoods.

Man, if we lose this one with all the inherent advantages we posses, it will look bad.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by NomadBison »

Just because something is shiny doesn’t mean it’s good. That in no way applies to Oregon or it’s resources. A hard hat and lunch bucket is all that’s needed. Pretty much everything NDSU does is privately funded and has little help from the state or relying on student fees. Some will claim that NDSU gets oil money. That is a BIG falsehood. Just a bunch of small town kids and coaches doing some great things and rising to the occasion.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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NomadBison wrote:Just because something is shiny doesn’t mean it’s good. That in no way applies to Oregon or it’s resources. A hard hat and lunch bucket is all that’s needed. Pretty much everything NDSU does is privately funded and has little help from the state or relying on student fees. Some will claim that NDSU gets oil money. That is a BIG falsehood. Just a bunch of small town kids and coaches doing some great things and rising to the occasion.
I can wholeheartedly agree with the first sentence. The problem is all of the G5 schools have been pouring money into their facilities for a couple of decades. All of the coaches on the recruiting trail are pitching the quality of the facilities and how they can take the kids game to the next level and have them ready for the NFL. If you don't have the shiny after all the silver tongued devils have come through, you won't be landing the top recruits and the program won't grow.

The other coaches will come in and say, don't go to NDSU because if they don't have the facilities, how can the make you great?
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GoDucksTroll
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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NomadBison wrote:Just because something is shiny doesn’t mean it’s good. That in no way applies to Oregon or it’s resources. A hard hat and lunch bucket is all that’s needed. Pretty much everything NDSU does is privately funded and has little help from the state or relying on student fees. Some will claim that NDSU gets oil money. That is a BIG falsehood. Just a bunch of small town kids and coaches doing some great things and rising to the occasion.
I don't disagree, if money and shiny things were the only factor in winning we'd be in the top-5 every year. Here are some facts though:

* NDSU does get 29% of it's revenue (which is $27 mil in more recent numbers than the 25 mil I said) from student fees and state funds. Source: https://www.argusleader.com/story/blogs ... 777622002/

In comparison, Oregon gets less money from student fees and the state in actual money. In percentages it's even more stark: 3% vs 29%.

* In FBS football money correlates to winning. It's not a direct correlation, but the school with the smallest AD revene in the final AP top-10 was Minnesota at $115 million. Six of the AP top-10 were in the top-10. Money matters. Unless you're Texas or Texas A&M getting some poor ROI.

* Maybe at FCS a hard hat and a lunch pail are enough. But in FBS you need luxurious facilities, equipment, tons of support staff, an army of video and graphics people, top nutrition and food, and a hundred other things.

* All of the following is needed for recruiting, and in order to secure the top-10/15 classes you need to compete at the highest level you have to fend off other programs with similar budgets, and other appeals outside of football.

The Oregon program is built on a long of hard work and passion, but money has been the catalyst.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by NomadBison »

ncduck wrote:
NomadBison wrote:Just because something is shiny doesn’t mean it’s good. That in no way applies to Oregon or it’s resources. A hard hat and lunch bucket is all that’s needed. Pretty much everything NDSU does is privately funded and has little help from the state or relying on student fees. Some will claim that NDSU gets oil money. That is a BIG falsehood. Just a bunch of small town kids and coaches doing some great things and rising to the occasion.
I can wholeheartedly agree with the first sentence. The problem is all of the G5 schools have been pouring money into their facilities for a couple of decades. All of the coaches on the recruiting trail are pitching the quality of the facilities and how they can take the kids game to the next level and have them ready for the NFL. If you don't have the shiny after all the silver tongued devils have come through, you won't be landing the top recruits and the program won't grow.

The other coaches will come in and say, don't go to NDSU because if they don't have the facilities, how can the make you great?
The thing with most of those G5 schools is that they are lacking in the tradition and culture aspect of a team and program. We do have very nice weight rooms, locker rooms refueling and food stations. All of that stuff is new. We are working funding on an IDPF as we speak. The oldest thing we have is the Fargo Dome which is about 20 now. It’s original plan was to seat like 27k but the mayor at the time was an idiot. You see we are constantly improving our facilities. Also as far as the recruiting thing. We target a lot of small town kids. Most of the time they have no star rating. Some eventually get to 4 stars once recruiting pics up but for the most part we offer about 65 kids and that’s it. We’re focused on certain areas and most of it is local. Being a developmental program and having an amazing strength and conditioning program we can develop these guys into ballers. Oregon can pretty much send a coach where ever they want to get a kid. NDSU not so much. You can’t send a 6’5” 230lb Fr walk on OL to the NFL without a great SC Program. We do get some hidden gems in our program. LB Jabril Cox is one of them. No stars and played QB in high school. NDSU is just a different program.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by NomadBison »

GoDucksTroll wrote:
NomadBison wrote:Just because something is shiny doesn’t mean it’s good. That in no way applies to Oregon or it’s resources. A hard hat and lunch bucket is all that’s needed. Pretty much everything NDSU does is privately funded and has little help from the state or relying on student fees. Some will claim that NDSU gets oil money. That is a BIG falsehood. Just a bunch of small town kids and coaches doing some great things and rising to the occasion.
I don't disagree, if money and shiny things were the only factor in winning we'd be in the top-5 every year. Here are some facts though:

* NDSU does get 29% of it's revenue (which is $27 mil in more recent numbers than the 25 mil I said) from student fees and state funds. Source: https://www.argusleader.com/story/blogs ... 777622002/

In comparison, Oregon gets less money from student fees and the state in actual money. In percentages it's even more stark: 3% vs 29%.

* In FBS football money correlates to winning. It's not a direct correlation, but the school with the smallest AD revene in the final AP top-10 was Minnesota at $115 million. Six of the AP top-10 were in the top-10. Money matters. Unless you're Texas or Texas A&M getting some poor ROI.

* Maybe at FCS a hard hat and a lunch pail are enough. But in FBS you need luxurious facilities, equipment, tons of support staff, an army of video and graphics people, top nutrition and food, and a hundred other things.

* All of the following is needed for recruiting, and in order to secure the top-10/15 classes you need to compete at the highest level you have to fend off other programs with similar budgets, and other appeals outside of football.

The Oregon program is built on a long of hard work and passion, but money has been the catalyst.
Minnesota could have all the money in the world and not win a thing. The sole reason that they have risen in the eyes of the nation is because of their coach and good for them. They have been a terrible team for a long time and had the same money (saying without looking). You have to have culture and I think Fleck has found that for them. Sure money helps but I suppose it depends on the program. Look at the FCS. I don’t think NDSU is even in the top 10 for money focused on the football program and has won 8 of the last 9. Sometimes a program just has IT.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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My word. Is there absolutely NOTHING to do in North Dakota???
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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DuckMastaFunk wrote:My word. Is there absolutely NOTHING to do in North Dakota???
Work, Hunt, Fish, Ski, Sledding, Dog Sledding, Hiking, Biking, Boating, Shopping, DRINKING, watch sports, play sports. What answer do you want to hear? You don’t like civil conversation without anyone thumping their chest?
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by rockthief »

DuckMastaFunk wrote:My word. Is there absolutely NOTHING to do in North Dakota???
You really mean this? It is outdoor paradise there, different than here of course, but there are things to do like there are anywhere.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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I think he was being sarcastic because there has been so much fan attention given by ND’s fans on a opponent’s forum 8 months before the game.
Last edited by UofDuck on Fri Feb 07, 2020 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

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ah ha!
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Re: NDSU/OREGON 2020

Post by gogreen55 »

I think it is great that NDSU fans are proud of their program, and they should be. I also think it is great they are excited enough about the game to be talking about it already, and that they feel like they have a legit shot at winning. All of this will make the game much more interesting.
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