#21 UCLA @ #13 Oregon (Oct 10, Sat 12:30 PM CBS)

[squintsdd]

Can anyone explain Raiola's floating passes?

He doesn't step into his throws and throws off his back foot a lot. It's almost like he's afraid to get hit while in his throwing motion.

[OregonFan4Life]

Can anyone explain Raiola's floating passes?

He doesn't step into his throws and throws off his back foot a lot. It's almost like he's afraid to get hit while I'm his throwing motion.

I watched a little more of the game, and his refusal to step into his throws is a major issue so hard to give him the benefit of the doubt, but when he does step back someone is almost immediately in his face cause the OLine can’t block anyone. It has to be a little harder to step into your throw knowing you’re about to get hit.


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[dthomas=ddixon]

Doug also pointed out a troubling reality: there’s been obvious issues at OL for 3 seasons now and the fact that no one on the staff identified that, or did anything about it, is concerning. And according to QB11, there are people close to the program who’ve been saying for years that Terry is a bad OL coach.

[pezsez1]

The “Will Stein is performing well because he hired a better OC and QB coach than he is” is intellectually lazy and completely twisted to fit the narrative of the Stein haters who are raw over this UCLA loss. I get it. It sucks. It hurts.

But if you couldn’t see that Stein was a well-above-average OC, there is no pleasing you.

Just saw this gem.

I'm not raw over the UCLA loss at all. Disappointed, sure, but anyone who was surprised by what happened doesn't know ball. Our coaching sucks, it has sucked almost all year, and it's a continuation of trends we've seen over the past couple years. Our offensive coaching has been deficient for some time now, and we plucked a branch from the same flawed tree. Play lazy games, win lazy prizes.

Stein was a good OC. He wasn't average, he was good. Everyone has always agreed on that. But he was never elite. His offense regularly sputtered in big games and key moments. Analytics are great, but it's hilarious that you're leaning completely on analytics while calling others "intellectually lazy." The analytics don't account for the massive talent advantages Oregon often has over its opponents. The analytics also don't account for Dante Moore or the O-line telegraphing every play to remotely aware defensive coaches. Who gives a flying **** if we convert fourth downs or move the ball up and down the field against overmatched teams? If you've watched the games and been honest with yourself then it's been clear we've been an underachieving offense.

Stein went out and hired an OC with three years of playcalling experience including two at LSU. That's literally the same amount of FBS playcalling experience as Stein has. Meanwhile, Lanning promoted from within, giving one of the state's three most important football jobs to a guy who'd only called plays (poorly) for one season at Rutgers. Look at both programs and take your L.

[OregonFan4Life]

Out of curiosity, are fans claiming Will Stein is great by comparing him to Drew? Just cause Will Stein was better than arguably the worst OC in America and the worst OC in Oregon history doesn’t make him great. Better? Obviously, but the offense still had flaws last year and there was a reason fans like Pez and I called for a full reset of the offense, including the offensive coaching staff. There is something broken with the offense Oregon and it didn’t start this year, but this year the dam completely fell apart.


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[dthomas=ddixon]

You’re arguing Stein wasn’t an elite OC despite producing three consecutive top-five offenses in opponent-adjusted efficiency based on your recollection of frustrating games and play calls. FEI specifically accounts for opponent strength and filters garbage time.

We absolutely had some poor postseason performances under Stein, but also put up 45 on Penn State and 32 on Ohio State. Elite defenses make even elite offenses struggle. And I’d argue Stein produced those elite offenses despite ongoing OL deficiencies that were especially exposed against elite defensive fronts.

If Stein consistently underperformed against them relative to other elite OCs, then you should be able to prove it with comparative data. Otherwise, you’re dismissing three seasons of objective evidence in favor of selective examples, while crediting talent for the successes and Stein for the failures.

And my question remains unanswered: If 3 consecutive top 5 offenses aren’t good enough, what exactly would be?

[squintsdd]

Can anyone explain Raiola's floating passes?

He doesn't step into his throws and throws off his back foot a lot. It's almost like he's afraid to get hit while I'm his throwing motion.

I watched a little more of the game, and his refusal to step into his throws is a major issue so hard to give him the benefit of the doubt, but when he does step back someone is almost immediately in his face cause the OLine can’t block anyone. It has to be a little harder to step into your throw knowing you’re about to get hit.


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That's a fair argument, but this has been an issue going back to his days at Nebraska. He wants to make the highlight reel pass rather just zipping one 10 yards and letting the receiver do the work after the catch

[pezsez1]

And my question remains unanswered: If 3 consecutive top 5 offenses aren’t good enough, what exactly would be?

An offense that showed consistency and didn't completely s*** the bed in the program's biggest games would be nice.

Will Stein had a stellar first season with 10th-year senior Bo Nix at quarterback. Once Bo left, the offense became predictable and inconsistent, and those problems have grown progressively worse each year. Player development is nonexistent. The line isn't getting better, the QB isn't getting better, the RBs aren't getting better, most receivers aren't getting better. Sometimes our offense looks great, but sometimes they look like they've never played football, and this isn't new. And in the playoffs we've been effectively stuffed two years in a row, only really scoring in the second half against relaxed defenses. Bad technique, telegraphic plays, stale playcalling.

Yeah, our offense looked good on paper. Is that the standard?

I never liked the idea of hiring Will Stein's protégé, and sadly my concerns proved to be valid. Trust me, I wish I had been wrong on this entire topic. Sometimes being wrong is a good thing. Wasn't the case this time, though.

[dthomas=ddixon]

I agree about shitting the bed in our biggest games, but that’s been a team-wide issue, not solely a Stein issue. And even Chip’s offenses struggled against elite defenses/game plans at times (BSU & tOSU in 2009, Cal & Auburn in 2010, LSU in 2011, Stanford in 2012).

After Nix left, our offense went from 1st to 2nd nationally in opponent-adjusted FEI. Then with Moore last year it was 5th. You can dismiss FEI but you still haven’t established an alternative meaningful standard beyond your own subjective judgments for what would be good enough.

As far as this year’s offense goes, I agree with a lot of your criticisms, but we’re discussing Stein’s three years as our play-caller. You’re attributing broader deficiencies in position coaching and player development to Stein without establishing how much responsibility he actually bears for them.

[pezsez1]

As I've said, Stein was a good playcaller, but he wasn't elite. I bet there are a ton of playcallers out there that would have looked fantastic with all the weapons on our roster. I mean I'd look fast if I drove a Ferrari, but that wouldn't make me a race car driver.