Ducks Attack Message Board Forum

No disrespect to Loyd, but we could have really used Artis this year. We are really a PG away from being a top team in the Pac-12.

It's to the point that I was pumping my fist when Loyd fouled out against CU. Artis will start from day one & really open things up for our offense.

The problem is that when Artis gets here, Joseph and Olu will be gone.

Phenom wrote:The problem is that when Artis gets here, Joseph and Olu will be gone.

I thought we had Joesph for one more year??? Must be wrong. Wish we had Olu for 10 more years LMAO guy is a BEAST

If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

woundedknees wrote:If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

This to me seems like the biggest issue for Dana right now. He is unable to adjust to players causing a ridiculous amount of push back by very talented players.

what?

Just because an apparently uber-talented player is on the team, doesn't make him a good teammate, or coach-able.

pudgejeff wrote:

woundedknees wrote:If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

This to me seems like the biggest issue for Dana right now. He is unable to adjust to players causing a ridiculous amount of push back by very talented players.

You're kidding right? Dana doesn't let his guys play undisciplined street ball. So a few me first, non conformings kids took off. And thank God for that. This isn't the NBA, in college a team needs a structured system to excell. Look at all the coaches that have sustained success, & have done it at places where they didn't just have tons of talent.

woundedknees wrote:Just because an apparently uber-talented player is on the team, doesn't make him a good teammate, or coach-able.

Then why recruit them? That's my #1 criticism with him at this point.


I completely agree with you that the loss of Armstead was a huge loss to this season (I've said it from the start) I was never a real big supporter to the Loyd signing.... or to the prospect of him being our starting PG.

But the loss of Barron & Brown puts us in a huge pinch moving forward.

Attendance has been a problem and It's not because we can't win games... I truly believe that it's hard for the casual fan to get behind a team filled with 1 year rentals. If he can't keep next years class together then I think it's time to search for a new coach.

dthomas=ddixon wrote:

pudgejeff wrote:

woundedknees wrote:If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

This to me seems like the biggest issue for Dana right now. He is unable to adjust to players causing a ridiculous amount of push back by very talented players.

You're kidding right? Dana doesn't let his guys play undisciplined street ball. So a few me first, non conformings kids took off. And thank God for that. This isn't the NBA, in college a team needs a structured system to excell. Look at all the coaches that have sustained success, & have done it at places where they didn't just have tons of talent.

You are joking right? I'm not saying that discipline and structure doesn't help, I'm not saying he needs to completely change his ideals or logic, but not only have players he's inherited transferred out, so now have some of his recruits. For this team to be at the level we all want, it's going to need some oober talented NBA type kids.

pudgejeff wrote:

dthomas=ddixon wrote:

pudgejeff wrote:

woundedknees wrote:If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

This to me seems like the biggest issue for Dana right now. He is unable to adjust to players causing a ridiculous amount of push back by very talented players.

You're kidding right? Dana doesn't let his guys play undisciplined street ball. So a few me first, non conformings kids took off. And thank God for that. This isn't the NBA, in college a team needs a structured system to excell. Look at all the coaches that have sustained success, & have done it at places where they didn't just have tons of talent.

You are joking right? I'm not saying that discipline and structure doesn't help, I'm not saying he needs to completely change his ideals or logic, but not only have players he's inherited transferred out, so now have some of his recruits. For this team to be at the level we all want, it's going to need some oober talented NBA type kids.

Well what are you saying then?

If there's anything to criticize its him failing to realize the kind of kids Jabari & Bruce were. They clearly hated the system we ran right away, he should have either made it much clearer to them what we run or done a much better job of finding out what it is that they wanted.

And obviously to get back to Elite 8 type runs we're going to need some NBA level talent. Not every talented player is a me first guy though, DA simply needs to do a better job finding guys who fit what we do. And not bringing in kids who have no desire to play in his system.

pudgejeff wrote:

dthomas=ddixon wrote:

pudgejeff wrote:

woundedknees wrote:If Malcolm Armstead had chosen to buy into the program and play out his career at Oregon, rather than transfer to Wichita State, or wherever he landed, the potential of this team would have been considerably better.

In some ways, I think that early departure was more detrimental than the unrealized potential of the departed Barron and Brown.

This to me seems like the biggest issue for Dana right now. He is unable to adjust to players causing a ridiculous amount of push back by very talented players.

You're kidding right? Dana doesn't let his guys play undisciplined street ball. So a few me first, non conformings kids took off. And thank God for that. This isn't the NBA, in college a team needs a structured system to excell. Look at all the coaches that have sustained success, & have done it at places where they didn't just have tons of talent.

You are joking right? I'm not saying that discipline and structure doesn't help, I'm not saying he needs to completely change his ideals or logic, but not only have players he's inherited transferred out, so now have some of his recruits. For this team to be at the level we all want, it's going to need some oober talented NBA type kids.

Artis is at the Ridnour and Brooks level. So as far as I can tell, DA is on the right track... I still fail to see the gripe with him.

pudgejeff wrote:For this team to be at the level we all want, it's going to need some uber talented NBA type kids.

Well, that's the way its always been at Oregon other than that Tall Firs team...

I'll add my 2c and that is that the players who left when he arrived is nothing that should be used against him-ever. It serves no point and frankly none of them have turned into the projections of what any of them were supposed to be.

As far as the Barron/Brown thing - that's just weird to me. I think that was an anomaly more than a pattern and the word "self-discipline" comes to mind. Of course, if something crazy happens and Artis were to transfer in a similar fashion, then yea, let's start asking some serious questions about what's going on behind the scenes. Other than that, I'm not sure entirely what the criticism of him has been? That we're losing a few games here and there in a weak P12? Have you seen our roster? (hence the thread itself)

I guess part of this frustration probably stems from the team having performed well under DA so far and wanting to see it go further, but at the same time, we've got to be a bit more level-headed about who this team has too. Anybody expecting us to have made the same change as the football team is setting the bar just a little too high when recognizing the state of the program that he inherited.

Unless there are serious rumors from players that he's just a richard, at which point, let's hear em and no simple stuff, I want details! lol

Duck07 wrote:

pudgejeff wrote:For this team to be at the level we all want, it's going to need some uber talented NBA type kids.

Well, that's the way its always been at Oregon other than that Tall Firs team...

I'll add my 2c and that is that the players who left when he arrived is nothing that should be used against him-ever. It serves no point and frankly none of them have turned into the projections of what any of them were supposed to be.

As far as the Barron/Brown thing - that's just weird to me. I think that was an anomaly more than a pattern and the word "self-discipline" comes to mind. Of course, if something crazy happens and Artis were to transfer in a similar fashion, then yea, let's start asking some serious questions about what's going on behind the scenes. Other than that, I'm not sure entirely what the criticism of him has been? That we're losing a few games here and there in a weak P12? Have you seen our roster? (hence the thread itself)

I guess part of this frustration probably stems from the team having performed well under DA so far and wanting to see it go further, but at the same time, we've got to be a bit more level-headed about who this team has too. Anybody expecting us to have made the same change as the football team is setting the bar just a little too high when recognizing the state of the program that he inherited.

Unless there are serious rumors from players that he's just a richard, at which point, let's hear em and no simple stuff, I want details! lol

I agree. As with my original post in this thread, I said it's his biggest issue right now. Meaning he has the ability to rectify it and show that it can be different. In saying it's his biggest issue, without it this team would look pretty good with Malcolm at the point and some depth at the guard positions in Brown and Barron. I also agree if there is problems with Artis that's a glaring sign of something. On the point of him being a "Richard" as you say, I have no insight from players, only from watching as he tends to pull players on mistakes and also to continue to berate them on the bench, it's tough to be successful when your worried one mistake is gonna get you pulled (see Emory's struggles and now new found confidence), and I know some people like coaches that coach this way, it's just not the way I think it should be done, and almost all the good coaches don't substitute on such a whim and have a better way of teaching from the mistakes real time as I assume he does a pretty good job behind the scenes in practice.