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Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:05 am
by Craig
Magic send:
ORL '92 1st (top 3 protected, unprotected thereafter)
Suns send:
Wayman Tisdale
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:10 am
by The Bean Regime
Interesting. Orlando obviously expecting to be good by then.
But have they ever been good? I'd take the gamble as Suns.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:18 am
by UOducksTK1
Ew for Magic. Veto.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:27 am
by Oregon Ownage
I dont understand
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:43 am
by the goat
Oregon Ownage wrote:I dont understand
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:48 am
by FlDuckFan
Seems I goofed? Let me know where my logic is wrong, here's my thinking.
I have the cap room to resign him, and with the rules being discussed it seems like bird years give me a bigger advantage of doing so after missing out in the market the last few years. I also don't plan on being this horribly bad all the way to 92. By trading a future 1 it accelerates my timeline in rebuilding while leaving me with shorter term assets to use . I've tanked well enough this far into the year where I don't think adding Tisdale will ruin my tank job for the upcoming draft, and pairing him with pooh and whomever I draft should give me a quality 3 man team to build even more around in FA. I also think he's worth a 1st.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:09 am
by lukeyrid13
Tisdale is expiring though and putting up inflated stats right now
I think maybe top 7-10 protection is fine but even if Tisdale was locked up, he and Pooh isn’t enough and multiple more pieces are needed
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:18 am
by offtheheezy
If Tisdale wasn’t expiring this would not be bad. I personally don’t think Tisdale is that amazing (biased
) but he’s a decent enough player that’s still young. ‘89, ‘90, ‘91 is more than enough to field a decent team together even if Tisdale stays the same
Good move by the Suns, big somewhat unnecessary risk on the Magic, but its reasonable to assume ‘92 Magic doesn’t have to be ridiculously bad esp since they don’t even have any major long term contracts in the books.
Wish I kept Tisdale to do this myself, but personally don’t think this is outrageous or veto worthy given there’s three full seasons.
Better than the Pierce trade imo
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:47 am
by dd10snoop28
Magic still a couple yrs out from competing so this was not the right time to make this move. I think a better strategy would be to preserve future picks and then when you are on the fringe of competing (look @ pacers last year) then group some future picks and trade them together in a move for a bonafide Allstar. Secondly, Tisdale is an above average starter, and you might be forced to pay him like an all-star.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:59 am
by UOducksTK1
FlDuckFan wrote:Seems I goofed? Let me know where my logic is wrong, here's my thinking.
I have the cap room to resign him, and with the rules being discussed it seems like bird years give me a bigger advantage of doing so after missing out in the market the last few years. I also don't plan on being this horribly bad all the way to 92. By trading a future 1 it accelerates my timeline in rebuilding while leaving me with shorter term assets to use . I've tanked well enough this far into the year where I don't think adding Tisdale will ruin my tank job for the upcoming draft, and pairing him with pooh and whomever I draft should give me a quality 3 man team to build even more around in FA. I also think he's worth a 1st.
Two main things:
-If you aren't going to compete, don't trade your firsts. Unless you have another trade where you are getting Michael Jordan lined up, then don't trade your firsts. They are gold. With Tisdale, you are still the worst team in the league.
-You want guys on rookie contracts as you rebuild. When you have guys on rookie contracts, that means you generally have cap space. And cap space that you can send on other guys. That way you not only have the rookie contract guys but some veteran guys you signed. By trading for Tisdale who is expiring, you will now have to give him a max contract which will take up a lot of your cap space, rendering things more difficult for you to sign other guys with less cap space.
Rebuild through FA and draft. Once you got 2 or 3 key pieces to help you win, that's when you make the move. Right now you have very little.
NOTE: Tisdale is worth a first, just not your 1992 1st. If you were trading like the Pistons or Nuggets 1st this year. Sure.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:01 am
by UOducksTK1
offtheheezy wrote:If Tisdale wasn’t expiring this would not be bad. I personally don’t think Tisdale is that amazing (biased
) but he’s a decent enough player that’s still young. ‘89, ‘90, ‘91 is more than enough to field a decent team together even if Tisdale stays the same
Love you heezy but this is bad advice. Magic literally only have Pooh. IF he also had a David Robinson or another key player, then maybe this is true.
And you really shouldn't ever be trading a 1992 1st (a first 4 years out) unless you are 100% sure you'll make playoffs then (Like Blazers with MJ or Nets with Ralph). This is terrible practice, especially for a guy like flduck who has never done FBB before this league.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:06 am
by offtheheezy
UOducksTK1 wrote:offtheheezy wrote:If Tisdale wasn’t expiring this would not be bad. I personally don’t think Tisdale is that amazing (biased
) but he’s a decent enough player that’s still young. ‘89, ‘90, ‘91 is more than enough to field a decent team together even if Tisdale stays the same
Love you heezy but this is bad advice. Magic literally only have Pooh. IF he also had a David Robinson or another key player, then maybe this is true.
And you really shouldn't ever be trading a 1992 1st (a first 4 years out) unless you are 100% sure you'll make playoffs then (Like Blazers with MJ or Nets with Ralph). This is terrible practice, especially for a guy like flduck who has never done FBB before this league.
That’s fair enough. Definitely as you mentioned trading out a future first that far ahead has its major risks. I think the point I was trying to say is that you can rebuild in 2-3 years fully
if you get one elite guy in the draft. The point you’re making which is fair is that this was done prior to obtaining said guy in draft.
On the flip side though, one could argue Magic is set up to be better in ‘92 than other aging teams. So it really a matter of whether the Magic can proactively improve their team year to year
Like I said, Suns definitively win right now given the probabilities
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:08 am
by Foxyg1396
UOducksTK1 wrote:offtheheezy wrote:If Tisdale wasn’t expiring this would not be bad. I personally don’t think Tisdale is that amazing (biased
) but he’s a decent enough player that’s still young. ‘89, ‘90, ‘91 is more than enough to field a decent team together even if Tisdale stays the same
Love you heezy but this is bad advice. Magic literally only have Pooh. IF he also had a David Robinson or another key player, then maybe this is true.
And you really shouldn't ever be trading a 1992 1st (a first 4 years out) unless you are 100% sure you'll make playoffs then (Like Blazers with MJ or Nets with Ralph). This is terrible practice, especially for a guy like flduck who has never done FBB before this league.
*cough* or nuggets with Stockton and Barkley locked in at the very least *cough*
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:08 am
by Craig
So we're cool with old teams with no future trading future 1sts but a re-building team with a clean slate, future all star PG, and upcoming top 4 pick cant trade something years down the road when the expectation is theyre a playoff team? I mean the Lakers and their sinking ship just traded a 92 1st for Joe Dumars amd nobody batted an eye lol.
I dunno, obvioisly Im biased and theres some potential upside for me but Im not seeing the consistency here.
Re: Magic/Suns
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:13 am
by offtheheezy
Foxyg1396 wrote:UOducksTK1 wrote:offtheheezy wrote:If Tisdale wasn’t expiring this would not be bad. I personally don’t think Tisdale is that amazing (biased
) but he’s a decent enough player that’s still young. ‘89, ‘90, ‘91 is more than enough to field a decent team together even if Tisdale stays the same
Love you heezy but this is bad advice. Magic literally only have Pooh. IF he also had a David Robinson or another key player, then maybe this is true.
And you really shouldn't ever be trading a 1992 1st (a first 4 years out) unless you are 100% sure you'll make playoffs then (Like Blazers with MJ or Nets with Ralph). This is terrible practice, especially for a guy like flduck who has never done FBB before this league.
*cough* or nuggets with Stockton and Barkley locked in at the very least *cough*
I refuse to include Stockton with the likes of MJ, Sampson, and donut man
